Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

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twister
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Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by twister »

Because he's sponsored by Yamamoto, I know I will Get Cooch's attention posting this one :!: When you buy a pack of $6 Senkos, you get 10 (5" or smaller)or 5 (9 series) baits. I can buy other brands for half the price. Being curious, I bought two packs of Wave Worms (www.wavefishing.com) from Walmart for $2.50 per pack of 10. The length of these worms are 5". I filled my sink up with water and simutaneously dropped a Senko and a Wave worm towards the bottom of the sink. The Senko touched bottom first--telling me that the Wave Worm has a slower fall. I would think the slower fall would have a bigger advantage when targeting those suspended fish because the bait stays in the stike zone longer. Subjectively, I do not yet know how these worms perform compared to my box of Senkos. I will find out this weekend on the Delta. So with all these things considered, are Senkos worth the extra money :?: :?: :?:

Whats up with those worms sold at Walmart and marketed as "Yamamoto Industries" baits? Is this a marketing ploy?
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MrSkeeter
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by MrSkeeter »

twister wrote:... The Senko touched bottom first--telling me that the Wave Worm has a slower fall. I would think the slower fall would have a bigger advantage when targeting those suspended fish because the bait stays in the stike zone longer. Subjectively, I do not yet know how these worms perform compared to my box of Senkos. I will find out this weekend on the Delta. So with all these things considered, are Senkos worth the extra money :?: :?: :?:

Whats up with those worms sold at Walmart and marketed as "Yamamoto Industries" baits? Is this a marketing ploy?
Only you can judge the effectiveness of each product. I've used waveworms on occassion w/ decent success. But if you want the varied colors, Senkos are heard to beat!

Concerning the Yamamoto Industries products, it's my understanding that they are by Derek Yamamoto's company (son of Gary I believe). They use the same mode and same process in making their products, but I think they have different colors. Priced the same if not a bit more expensive I thought.
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by miklanderson »

Kinami baits are the ones sold at Walmart. They are made by Gary Yamamotos son from what i hear.

As far as Senkos vs. other stick baits I've tried most of them but I keep going back to the Senkos because they seem to put more fish in the boat...
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Bill K
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by Bill K »

In the long haul, GYCB & Kanami are the only way to fly. They will
pull more fish than any of the others over time and conditions. Bill K
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Marc
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You Be The Judge

Post by Marc »

The decision about "value" must be made by both you, and the bass you are targeting.

Here are a couple of reasons why I prefer Yamamoto baits.

1. Innovation, not imitation. Gary is the designer and originator of the design, and he has perfected it. All the others have copied portions of his design, but not the entire concept. Kinami Baits are basically the same, and are produced by Derek Yamamoto (Gary's son), with Gary's permission and incorporating the same design features but in different colors, packaging, and distributed in different markets.

I prefer to give my money to the guys who use it to design the next baits that will improve my enjoyment of fishing. The imitators don't usually reinvest consumer dollars to design new lures...they just copy and profit. If we don't support the innovators, we had better be prepared to fish the same old designs forever.

2. Yamamoto Baits use more salt, as a key ingredient. This not only gives the bait the additional weight and a different specific gravity, but also affects its flexibility, feel, and taste. Bass tell me that Gary got it right. Sure, there will be times when bass may prefer a slower falling bait, but there are tons of soft plastic designs for these situations. What other bait lets you pitch long distance (weightless) and have the appeal that a Yamamoto bait has?

3. Yamamoto Baits have done the right thing and paid the royalties for the rights to use the salt, which was a design patent by Gene Larew Co. Most of the imitators do not, and when they get called on the carpet they quit making baits. Yamamoto products will still be there for us.

4. Gary Yamamoto Custom Baits supports the industry, and bass fishermen. They sponsor tons of events at all levels, and even work on the international level in raising the visibility of bass fishing around the world. We all benefit from this.

5. They produce a great magazine, and instructional videos to help anglers of all levels enjoy fishing to its fullest.

6. They are great people, and they are not happy unless the anglers are happy with them as a company and partner in fishing.

Those are my primary reasons, along with the fact that these baits flat catch bass!

ciao,
Marc Marcantonio
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by twister »

Mr Skeeter,

Yes, color is very important. Just a couple of weeks ago, I was fishing in the Delta with a Blk/Blu senko in clear gin colored water. A fish came tp to it and shyed away. I switched over to the pumpkin and he bit. My belief is that color matters when the water is clear. In general pumpkin and watermelon are the most productive in this situation in the Delta. These two colors are offered by Wave Worms. Bright patterns and those with flake come into play when the water is stained like Dissapointment Slough. Senko also offers larger 9 series worms for attracting those larger fish. But If I were to choose one size, I would choose 5". Don't get me wrong, the Senko fishes fine. I think its shorcomings are its lack of durability and high price. On a good day I can burn through a whole pack of 10 and sometimes more.
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Mark Langner
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by Mark Langner »

twister wrote:Mr Skeeter,

I think its shorcomings are its lack of durability and high price. On a good day I can burn through a whole pack of 10 and sometimes more.
Something to consider....I used to be a tad bummed that the Senkos self destructed so easilly until I gave it a few more thoughts. The fact that it is so soft is (IMO) part of why a bass holds onto it so long...this is actually a good thing. Many times I'll flip a Senko...dead stick it...and barely pull up on the rod to "feel" that fish that has the bait and set my hook. The fact that the bass held onto it so long even though I may not have seen a line jump may be due in part to it's softness (and salt, shape, etc). Another thing...with the bait that soft, it allows for a really good hook set, even for those (like me) that need to learn to be a bit more aggressive in setting the hooks. Basically, I now think the bait being so soft is a good thing !!!
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If I catch a fish a bait I am a happy boy!

Post by ash »

It still kills me that with 30-40k bass boat a 20-35k truck, 2-3k in electronics +gas, time off etc...

There is griping about a bait that cost 6.00 for a bag of 10, and consistantly catches fish! To me the 6.00 a bag for 10 fish = great day on the water.

I am with Mark M, Yammamoto supports the industry from grass roots clubs, kids events, to pro events. Their innovation and customer service is excellent, whenever I call (me just lil ole me who no one has heard of) and say I really need this order by thursday, you would think it was Gary himself asking for it.

What can I say, I have used hand pours for yammamoto molds, they fall slower, dont have the conistancy. And when the bite is wide open they catch fish. My only problem is I am always a day late on a wide open bite. :wink:
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bigbasser
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senkos

Post by bigbasser »

I like one Wacko's ( www.wackyworm.com ). bigbasser :D :) :o :lol: :P
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twister
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by twister »

Hey guys, you can't blame a guy for trying something new. If I find the wave worms to be less productive then, I'll drop them and bow to Senkos. But, like most of us bass guys, we like to try something a little different. I however can't say that for all of us judging from the responses. I don't compete in tournaments and I don't have a 40k truck pulling my 40k boat. Thats nothing but a stereotype. I just fish and I know when I get the 70+ mph boat and gas hogging truck to pull, it will not make me a better fisherman. Hey if you have endless amounts of money to spend on fishing then more power to you, but alot of us have other bills. So for those on a budget, I will keep you posted on how these compare to my more expesive Senkos--the bass will tell us not Gary. 8)
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Steve
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Its the weight and fall rate

Post by Steve »

Ive found that in certain instances copy cat baits dont have the weight needed to get through the cover Im fishing. They just arent heavy enough. Instead of drifting enticingly down through flooded bushes/trees and thick weed clumps, the copy cats get hung up since they lack that needed weight. Just something to think about.

Plus, I havent seen a copy cat that has that tip/tip waggle of a senko yet. In open water you can get away with copy cats, but not in cover.
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Twister

Post by Marc »

Though I have never used one, I'm sure that Wave worms will catch bass. There is no one lure that that is the end all be all, and one of the great things about fishing for bass in the US is that there are lots of choices, and we are all free to exercise them.

I took your questions as sincere, and simply responded sincerely. Fishing is about enjoyment, and this should be anyone's primary reason for the choices that they make.

ciao,
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Wave Worms

Post by MasterBassinator »

Wave worms work just as good. I prefer rigging them wacky style with no weight. Bass hammer it that way. So far I have really found no difference between the senkos and wave worms when it comes to catching bass. Wave worms and senko's look and feel exactly the same. They even have the same action. When you use wave worms, you swear your using senkos. Anyways, If you are low on money, i say go the wave worm route. Otherwise, it doesn't matter. I dont think the weight of the senko would make a difference if your flipping in heavy cover because your gonna be using a weight with it anyways. However, whats good about the senkos is that they have different sizes and i do believe wave worms only come in one size. 8)
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Rob D
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Yamamoto or Kimini

Post by Rob D »

Yamamato or Kimini are the only genuine deal, and personally I only use the Yamamoto. ALL the rest are just copys of someone elses hard earned ideas and research, then they just come along and STEAL the idea. They are no better than a common theifs!! Stealing someone elses idea is no different to me than stealing my boat or truck. THEY'RE JUST THIEVES!!
That's just my opinion, I could be wrong :)
I fish because I CAN!!
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Cooch

My appologies Twister............

Post by Cooch »

my attention span has been some what tunnel visioned as of late. Being on the water often has that affect on me. :D

To answer yer two questions, I'd certainly have to echo my fellow Yamamoto Pro-Staffer, Marc's comments to a T. I'd also have to add that the cost of a bag of Senkos, is the same price today, as it was 6+ years ago when they first came out. And they are not any more expensive than a bag of grubs, Ikas, lizards or any other worms sold by Yamamoto. Some might complain about the pliability of the plastic, yet those same anglers don't mention how the tails are easily bitten off the grubs when used as jig trailers. Or what about Robo's 5" Zipper worms, two bites, that piece of plastic is done! Yet no one complains, but dang, the Senko complaints go on. One wonders why this is? For me, torn up baits is a positive sign, it means I'm gitting bit and bit OFTEN! I wouldn't trade that fer cheaper clones any day.

It's the nature of the beast. The baits softness, is a major ingrediant to it's effectiveness. The componants of this bait go a lot further than what is leaked out to the angling public. There are ingrediants and processes that are secretely administered to this bait that no other cloning company uses. Hence yes, they are drastically different. You bite into a Senko, then bite into a clone, you'll see. You toss a Senko and clone bait in a pool, side by side with a hook and line attached, you'll see a major difference. I would disagree with anyone who claims they are equal, this simply is not true.

Are they worth the extra money you ask, you bet yer $6.99 they are! If ya want further proof, just go look at the inventory of the Yamamoto baits versus the clones in your local Bass Shop. That will be the vey truest gauge of their effectiveness, short of what your doing, experiementing for yourself.

As for the baits under the Yamamoto Industies label, that indeed is Kinami. The company is owned and run by Derek Yamamoto, Gary's son. They are the same baits, made in the same plant as the GYCB products. Kinami shares a few of the standard bait models and colors as the parent company. Yet Kinami also has a number of proprietary colors, the NoriBug and cranks, which are not in the standard GYCB product line. The packaging is indeed different, fewer baits, lower cost per bag and marketed outside of the typical "Bass Fishermen's" niche. This was done in a marketing effort to hit a much larger angler base, exposing the Yamamoto product line of baits to more than quadruple the anglers through out this country.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it! :lol:
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by The Choad »

Hey prostaffers! Keep in mind that I am a loyal yamamoto customer and rarely use the competitors baits but this thread raises two questions for me.

First, Cooch suggests biting into a senko and its competitors product to compare the difference. Now I don't have a pack in front of me right now but I swear the last time I looked, the package had a warning claiming that the 'product contained a product known to the state of California to cause cancer '. I don't think that it is referrring to salt . Is one of the 'secret' ingredients lead? I sure hope we're not suggesting that people bite into lead containing products. Or any other carcinogens for that matter.

Secondly, RUMOR has it that the guy who created wave worms actually helped Gary Yamamoto create the senko (wave pro staff). If that is true then he is also privy to any 'secret' ingredients. I truly believe that senkos sink faster than everyone else but if this is true then why can't the competition touch yamamoto/kimami. Is it simply the salt comntent and the costs associated with it?
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by twister »

Well I knew I was opening a can of worms when I posted the question (no pun intended x :P ). I went fishing with the wave worms today @ Sycamore and Hog Slough. I started somewhere in the middle of the outgoing tide. It was windy. I fished with 5" Senko, 5" Wave Worm (ww) , and a Black Jig with a Yamamoto Twin Tail Grub. Both the Senko and WW caught fish. The fall rate of the ww was slower. This made me a little impatient because I'm use to the faster fall of the Senko. But I soon adjusted. Like the Senko, most fish grabbed the worm on the fall. The weight of the WW is a little lighter, so you have to pitch a little harder. The WW definely went through more fish before changing. The Senkos usually fall off durring a head shake. The WW stayed on the line during the fight but like Senkos they broke at the bottom hook insert.

This is not a scientific experiment but from this experience I will continue to buy the larger 9L Senkos. I will use WW when fishing smaller 5" sizes. Call me a penny pincher but I have found no reason not to save a little money. 6.99-2.50=$4.49/day; If you go thru 10 packs per year then $44.90. Sorry, I'll add this money to that follow up guide trip I'm wanting to do with Cooch. He'll probably throw those WW off the side of the boat (kidding) . Hey guys thanks for all the input, tightlines! :D
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by Corn »

FWIW, I'll use the Waveworms if they have the color I need. Otherwise, it's the senko/Kinami.

I once bought a pack of the clones from Ebay ... I think it was Whitey's Plastics. I wacky rigged a senko, a waveworm and that clone, dropped each one into a large white tub of water. The senko and the waveworm both had that nice wounded wiggle on the way down. That clone dropped down like a rubber pencil ... no wiggle at all. Hardly a scientific study, but it told me enough to conclude that not all clones, no matter how similar they look, will have the same action... and that Waveworms are a very cheap substitute. In addition to the salt, Waveworms have some kind of anise scent added. My 2cents.
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by Basslab »

I've tried them all but recently have switched to the BPS brand Sticko for a couple reasons. The normal price is $4.50 per bag but recently had a sale for $3.33 a bag of 20. Yeah, 20 per bag instead of 10 equates to approximately 1/4 the cost of Senkos and they do catch fish and will stay on for 4-5 fish. Recently at Clearlake I boated a 9.1 and then an 8.2 with the same worm while the fall rate appears very similar. The color selection is vast and you can find virtually any color you need. Senkos are great and I still have a few selected colors and will continue to use them when new colors are introduced as the local bass shops carry a great selection of the baits. Just my opinion.
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by Tm Customs »

Hey guy's,
I have only bought a few bags of GY senkos in my life and have to say there great! The catch alot of fish for people who dont know senkos acculy have sand as well as salt in them this helps them fall super fast and keep them soft to get that super shimmy on the way down. People complain of copies of the senko when the senko is a copy of Gene Larews original Deadstick bait the "Salty Sling" Which is a senko w/ out rings it was many of the pros "Secret Bait" in the late 70's! No doubt in my mind this bait inspired the senko, I belive the GY senko is probably the best because it comes in countless colors and it is a confidence bait because of its acccomplishments, BUT..... costing GY only a few cents to make I dont think there worth .60ea I pour all of my own senko type baits from a clone GY mold and I can make my own colors and add any amount of salt to make them sink faster or slower and have cought a TON of bass in the Delta amoung other places w/ them. I have outfished people using GY senkos maney times mostly because of my knolage of fishing senkos the right combo of hook and line and CONFIDENCE! I belive you can catch fish w/ any of the senko type bait out there w/ confidience it really helps! As for senkos there a good bait and will always catch fish impossible to fish wrong so thank GY for introducing them to the bass world!
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Senko thoughts...

Post by Triton Mike »

I agree w/ Cooch and Marc's comments. I will also say that I am on the GYCB prostaff as well. I asked to be on there partly to help pay for my senko addiction it is definitely worth the $6.99 I paid when it puts fish in the boat for your clients when all else fails. I will say there are times when the Senko and other knockoffs are just as effective especially when the fish are taking it off the surface. However one the biggest advantage of the senko is when the fish are holding deep and there isn't a weightless worm that gets down there faster than the Senko. I've done the swimming pool test myself and the action is amazing on the fall.

T Mike
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Senkos

Post by Andy Giannini »

They work so well, farting around with anybody else's attempt at it is not worth the time. Yes, you can catch fish on a copy, but the bites missed inbetween is not worth it in my book. Time on the water is expensive, and valuable I don't waste any of it. That time is not worth saving a few pennies on line, a lousy knot, dull hook, or a second best plastic offering.

A funny sideline to this is a friend of mine that had some Senko handpour copies, in a killer color that just did not sink. I tried handpouring copies and they did not do well at all. (Gave up.)

The big issue with a new type bait is the originator. That guy had a concept, goal, desired results, and many more things factored into the original design, that finally made it into production. Everyone else just looks at the finished product, and thinks

"I can make that."

Minute details can be lost along the way, coming up with a knockoff. If someone offered me a lifetime supply of "Suckos" the answer would be no. I would rather continue buying them at retail like everyone else. Not because of any relationship to GYB co. just because I am not interested. They work the best, garner more bites, and big bites than any johnny come lately. And because of the fish caught, Yammie has earned my unswerving loyalty.

Guys complain, but for me buying Senkos is just like buying condoms. The pharmacist looks at me, they are expensive, but I don't care because each one is going to be fun.

The fish in my avatar weighs about six pounds, caught on a Senko.

.02 A.G.
"If you can't win, at LEAST catch the Big Fish!"
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Nice comparison AG....

Post by Gator »

I'll never think of a senko the same way again......you have scarred me for life......

Hehehehe......ncompaow, get your butt signed up for the Rally. I don't wanna hear any excuses....
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re:Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by delta1124 »

I have tried some of the similar baits with some success, however I used them because they had a color or difference that Senko doesn't offer, in a word I was looking for something a little different. As to their distructability, they are on the fragile side, but I have found that using the right hook and hooking the bait properly make a big difference in how they hold up. I also know that keeping them OUT OF THE SUN! is very important. Once they get hot they seem to break down much more quickly. That also goes for certain color combinations, some colors like black just don't stay together well.

There is no doubt in my mind that GYBC baits are the best available in their offerings and I will continue using them. I have also looked into puoring my own baits, buying molds from Del-Mart, then I thought about it, my off time is too little already, I don't want to spend it ouring plastics. Anything I could think of is probably already being made and on the market.

The Senko is a great bait, but if your on top of a bunch of dinks and your feeding them .60 cent Senkos it may be time to change things up and look for a bait to attract bigger fish. I guess for me the bottom line is I will continue to use what I have had success with, but not forget about other techniques and baits, many of which I learned about by reading the different posts here on westernbass.
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Interestingly enough...

Post by sTony »

I use the Iovino spade tail worms a lot, with and without a weight. Maybe it's just me but they tend to get torn up or lost just as easily as any Senko I've ever thrown. At the same time I've caught mulitple fish with a Senko and a Spade tail worm and one day used one senko the majority of the day and never lost it. I also use Pro's Soft Bait Glue to attach worms to my hooks and to repair tears and it definitely extends the lifetime of all my plastics.

sTony
Cooch

Hey Choad!

Post by Cooch »

What products do we purchase here in California, don't have that label on it? According to all the labels in this state, and it's just not abut fishing, I should have been dead 20 years ago! Course, I smoke, enjoy my Vino and tow my boat at 70+ too Guess I live on the edge and don't pay too much attention to warning signs! :lol:

And speakin of labels, I can't speak fer Wave Worms and the clones, but I just checked through about 8 different boxes of Yammie products in my shop, nary a single warning label on what GYCB has sent me, so yer more than welcome ta come by and sample one of my plastic baits! MMMM MMMM GOOD! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Tm Customs
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Re: Senkos vs Other Stick Baits

Post by Tm Customs »

Cooch is right check out those candy bar wrapers WARNING MAY CAUSE CANCER
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Ewww ....... don't do it!

Post by kopper_bass »

I wasn't thinking the other day as i was retie-ing my wacky rig and just threw that senko in my mouth to free up both hands. DOH!

Not only did I get enough salt intake for a week, i think some of my liquid Smelly Jelly got on it too and gave me a really bad taste in my mouth. Ewww! I quickly spit it out and said "that was stupid!" :roll:

I can tell ya too, dogs really love 'em!!
I just tie a senko directly to my line (no hook) and throw it around the yard and watch the dog go crazy chasing it. Be warned though - once she bites it, she won't let go - just like a fish!

Pitch 'em, Jig 'em, or Wacky rig 'em; .... just don't eat 'em!
Har! Har!

Kopper_Bass
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